Translation: "ddu*a can^` ca^u thay vi` cho xa^u ca',"
>>> vu@ssrc.org 12/9/2004 3:40:43 PM >>>
Hi all,
I am wondering if anyone has suggestions for the translation of a Vietnamese saying: "ddu*a can^` ca^u thay vi` cho xa^u ca'," literally interpreted as "giving the fishing rod instead of a string of fish." It basically means giving the means rather than an end-product as a way of helping somebody. Is there any equivalent saying in English for this phrase?
Thanks a lot for your insights.
Anh H. Vu
Vietnam Program Assistant
Social Science Research Council
810 Seventh Avenue
New York, NY 10019
Tel: (212) 377 2700, ext. 468
Fax: (212) 377 2727
Email: vu@ssrc.org
Website: http://www.ssrc.org
From hdta@loc.gov Thu Dec 9 12:57:02 2004
Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 15:57:19 -0500
From: Hong D Ta <hdta@loc.gov>
Reply-To: vsg@u.washington.edu
To: Vietnam Studies Group <vsg@u.washington.edu>
Subject: Re: translation: "ddu*a can^` ca^u thay vi` cho xa^u ca',"
Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today. Teach a man to fish; and you have fed him for a lifetime.
For humorous variations, go to: http://www.amatecon.com/fish.html
From steve_leisz@yahoo.com Thu Dec 9 17:43:30 2004
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 02:42:16 +0100
From: Stephen J. Leisz <steve_leisz@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: vsg@u.washington.edu
To: Vietnam Studies Group <vsg@u.washington.edu>
Subject: RE: translation: "ddu*a can^` ca^u thay vi` cho xa^u ca',"
I think you are looking for "give a man a fish and he eats for a day, teach a man to fish and he eats for a lifetime."
Stephen J. Leisz
LTA USEPAM / Research Fellow IGUC
email: sle@geogr.ku.dk
Address:
CARES/Hanoi Agricultural University
Gia Lam, Hanoi
Vietnam
From leductony@yahoo.com Thu Dec 9 18:23:36 2004
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 18:22:13 -0800 (PST)
From: Anthony Le <leductony@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: vsg@u.washington.edu
To: Vietnam Studies Group <vsg@u.washington.edu>
Subject: RE: translation: "ddu*a can^` ca^u thay vi` cho xa^u ca',"
I would probably translate it:
"Give a man a fish rod, not the fish".
anthony
From jhannah@u.washington.edu Thu Dec 9 20:06:40 2004
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 20:05:29 -0800 (PST)
From: Joe Hannah <jhannah@u.washington.edu>
Reply-To: vsg@u.washington.edu
To: Vietnam Studies Group <vsg@u.washington.edu>
Subject: RE: translation: "ddu*a can^` ca^u thay vi` cho xa^u ca',"
Some interesting anecdotal history:
In the early 1990s when the international NGOs were just starting to open offices in Hanoi and NGO/deevlopment work was just getting off the ground, many Vietnamese government officials, counterpart staff and beneficiaries believed teh NGOs were "charity organizations," there to pass out money and other material goods. As a part of explaining their mission, several NGOs used this folksy saying, which was easily translated into Vietnamese: "Give a man a fish and he eats for a day, teach a man to fish and he eats for a lifetime." (Most of us had not heard the Vietnamese expression Vu asked about at the beginning of this thread.)
As the mission of the international NGOs became better understood, Vietnamese counterpart agencies and partner organizations began to pick up on this expression, in part to manage the expectations of their own constituencies. However, the expression was often rendered with a twist: "Give a man a fish and he eats for a day, teach a man to fish and give him a fishing pole, and he eats for a lifetime." This insertion of the gift of the fishing pole seemed to continue a (somewhat reduced) expectation of material aid from the international agencies.
By the way, some folks attribute this saying to Confucious, though I have no idea as to the truth of this.
Cheers!
Joe
From markustaussig@mac.com Thu Dec 9 20:15:11 2004
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 11:13:58 +0700
From: Markus Taussig <markustaussig@mac.com>
Reply-To: vsg@u.washington.edu
To: Vietnam Studies Group <vsg@u.washington.edu>
Subject: Re: translation: "ddu*a can^` ca^u thay vi` cho xa^u ca',"
Joe,
That's a fabulous anecdote. Gotta admit, though: I think the adapted saying may also very accurately reflect on the supply side as much as the demand side of the development industry in Vietnam! If someone hasn't thought of it already, your email very well may have just inspired a new donor-funded micro finance program for poor people in some particular district in Vietnam to finance their purchases of fishing poles!
Markus
_______________________________
Markus D. Taussig
Private Sector Development Research
VOIP (Global Access) Tel: (202) 204 0963
Vietnam Mobile: (84) 903 25 8774
markustaussig@mac.com
http://homepage.mac.com/markustaussig/
From ProschanF@folklife.si.edu Fri Dec 10 06:49:10 2004
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 09:45:47 -0500
From: Frank Proschan <ProschanF@folklife.si.edu>
Reply-To: vsg@u.washington.edu
To: Vietnam Studies Group <vsg@u.washington.edu>
Subject: RE: translation: "ddu*a can^` ca^u thay vi` cho xa^u ca',"
Like Joe, I have a hunch this is a translation from the international development sloganeers. Although it is attributed on various web pages to "Confucius" and "Old Chinese Saying", those strike me as dubious attributions. The folklorist in me would be interested if anyone can provide any attested usage of the slogan in pre-USAID, pre-UNDP, pre-World Bank Vietnam. At least in the form offered by Vu, it just doesn't sound like a traditional Vietnamese-language proverb or saying. I will happily have my hunch disproven, but before calling it "a Vietnamese saying" I think we need better evidence.
With best regards,
Frank Proschan
Project Director